Get ready for an electrifying conversation with New York Times best-selling author, Mary Burton. Known for her captivating, suspense-filled novels, Mary takes us on a journey into her latest book, "House Beyond the Dunes," and shares her unique insight into the art of character development.
The episode takes a thrilling turn as we delve into the fascinating world of forensics. Its impact on Mary's writing career is truly astounding. We uncover the evolution of forensic tools, the critical role of research in crafting gripping narratives, and how an English major transitioned into a successful author. Mary provides invaluable insights into continuous learning in the writing realm. We then venture into crafting characters, with a deep dive into their wants and needs, and how they form the foundation of compelling narratives. Mary's approach to character development is truly inspiring, and her emphasis on the reader's role in interpreting and envisioning the story is thought-provoking.
We wrap up the episode uncovering the mystery of writing under a pseudonym and Mary's upcoming projects. Writing under different brands for her suspense and women's fiction novels brings a new dimension to her works and keeps her readers guessing. The episode concludes with Mary's philosophy of always moving forward and setting daily page goals to unleash her creativity. Join us for this insightful exchange, where stories are born from the everyday and writing becomes an exploration of the human psyche. Listen in, and let your imagination run wild!
Get ready for an electrifying conversation with New York Times best-selling author, Mary Burton. Known for her captivating, suspense-filled novels, Mary takes us on a journey into her latest book, "House Beyond the Dunes," and shares her unique insight into the art of character development.
The episode takes a thrilling turn as we delve into the fascinating world of forensics. Its impact on Mary's writing career is truly astounding. We uncover the evolution of forensic tools, the critical role of research in crafting gripping narratives, and how an English major transitioned into a successful author. Mary provides invaluable insights into continuous learning in the writing realm. We then venture into crafting characters, with a deep dive into their wants and needs, and how they form the foundation of compelling narratives. Mary's approach to character development is truly inspiring, and her emphasis on the reader's role in interpreting and envisioning the story is thought-provoking.
We wrap up the episode uncovering the mystery of writing under a pseudonym and Mary's upcoming projects. Writing under different brands for her suspense and women's fiction novels brings a new dimension to her works and keeps her readers guessing. The episode concludes with Mary's philosophy of always moving forward and setting daily page goals to unleash her creativity. Join us for this insightful exchange, where stories are born from the everyday and writing becomes an exploration of the human psyche. Listen in, and let your imagination run wild!
Hey guys, welcome back to our best behavior.
Speaker 2:I'm Mack and I'm here with You're still supposed to say that it's Mack and Kelly. One of these days you'll get it right.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:All right. Well, I have been on a journey, mccoy. I've been giving you a little bit of a break. I've been doing a lot of interviews with people. I have a lot of responses of people who, from people who want to do an episode, so I am getting super busy and it's exciting, aren't you happy?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:All right. Do you have anything? Any life updates? What's going on? What have you been up to?
Speaker 1:I just like getting. I got the first, I got. Oh my god, I got past the first week of my a new trimester school.
Speaker 2:How's that been? What do you do, like your classes?
Speaker 1:They're okay. They're not the best, though.
Speaker 2:So I was asking you, like, what are you learning about, what are you doing in your new trimester? And you told me, like you did the same thing in three different classes, like a Slideshow presentation, like you had to fill in what you liked or certain things. Yeah, has it gotten better.
Speaker 1:What do you mean better?
Speaker 2:like classes gotten better.
Speaker 1:I mean I get, yeah, I feel like, just because we don't do slideshows.
Speaker 2:What's your favorite class right now?
Speaker 1:Probably I was gonna tell.
Speaker 3:I think, about that.
Speaker 1:Give me a second.
Speaker 2:So whenever you come home from school I always say do you have any drama for your mama for the podcast? And you did tell me a funny story this this week, last week, and it's not really funny but it's kind of funny now that it's over. But it was about your Science teacher.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's my favorite class, only cuz I have Logan in it.
Speaker 2:What happened to that teacher?
Speaker 1:He tripped on someone's back and he fell it was really funny.
Speaker 2:That's the end of your story. That's all you have to say about it.
Speaker 1:Well, I mean, that's basically what happened.
Speaker 2:All right, well, I'll talk. I'll talk a little bit. Do you have a story for the podcast today? Oh, that was it. You didn't have anything else to elaborate about the story. I tried to lay it down for you I.
Speaker 1:Mean, I just fell and ate it. I guess I don't really know it was just he fell.
Speaker 2:So this weekend all I did is work on the podcast. So one by super fast, we went to you, got a haircut and it turned out really good. We went to Starbucks because you're like, all I really want is a mocha cookie crumble and we were in line and I was ordering. I usually order through the mobile app, but we were right there so I just drove in, ordered and you go Mom, you sound so nice and I go. I do try to be nice to people and you go. It's really funny. You're either really nice or like savage mean.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I did cuz it's true. I don't know, it's just really different.
Speaker 2:We went to the Yanukkah home basketball game and they won. I think Anoka is undefeated. They do play tonight, so hopefully they keep that up. Go tornadoes.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, let's win. The other team got destroyed last time.
Speaker 2:And it was and over. They're like a rival for us so we always want to beat, and over Blaine Coon Rapids we. So I was getting my nails. So the new squid game came out and it's Different, it's like a reality show challenge. And I didn't really know that, I guess, and I didn't plan on watching it Cuz I honestly really wasn't that excited about the first squid game. It didn't do anything for me. I know you watched it, but I was getting my nails done and they had it like playing on the TV and I thought I Just kind of started to get intrigued. So I'm like I'm actually gonna watch that at home. So I started watching it and you would. Every time you'd walk by the TV or we'd eat dinner together and we watched it, you kind of got hooked.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was a dick thing, it was pretty good, it was pretty good.
Speaker 2:And you were really good at guessing a lot of the. I mean, it wasn't really games, but they did a lot of things. That was kind of like by chance and you would be like I would do this, I would pick this, I would go there, and you were right like 95% of the time. I think it's your superpower.
Speaker 1:I don't know, I'm just. I'm just that good.
Speaker 2:Also this week, justin made you come up with something where you had to say 10 nice things about each of us and then one thing that you didn't like about each of us, and that was fun. It was alright.
Speaker 1:It was alright. What was the one thing that you didn't?
Speaker 2:like about me, you're a fun police sometimes.
Speaker 1:What was the one thing that you didn't?
Speaker 2:like about Justin you can't fuck with him, but he can fuck with you. And what was your thing that you liked the most about me?
Speaker 1:Oh, my god.
Speaker 2:You're both top.
Speaker 1:Things are funny.
Speaker 2:Oh, you're both funny. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's right. I couldn't remember what your favorite thing was. Alright, well, I'm really excited. We have a great guest for you today. So, without further ado, I am gonna let you go ahead and listen to this great interview.
Speaker 1:Hey guys, it's me, I'm Mack, dog. I'm kidding.
Speaker 2:Just kidding. Here comes. You're listening to another episode of on our best behavior, and today I am delighted to introduce my guest. She is a New York Times best-selling author. She writes novels that combine thrilling suspense, romance and riveting plot twists. You can get her most recent book, house beyond the dunes now. She is also one of my favorite authors. Welcome, mary Burton. Thanks for having me. This is great. So let's start with some introductions. I kind of put there in a nutshell about who I think you are, but tell us about who you are, what you do, what you like, what you love.
Speaker 3:Well, well, I'm a writer and I write under two names. I write suspense under Mary Burton and then I created Mary Ellen Taylor, about 12 years ago I guess, and I write a book a year under that name and a book a year under Mary Burton. So between the two that keeps me pretty busy. My husband, I, moved to the Outer Banks of North Carolina a few years ago. We decided we'd always wanted to live at the beach and so we came down here and and we're loving it. So that's me in a nutshell.
Speaker 3:Most of my time is spent writing, reading, focusing on the latest book in progress. You know, I guess for fun, I love to work out, weight, train, trx, walks, cycling, so that's my outlet beyond the computer. But that that's me in a nutshell. I have two kids. They're grown, they've flown the nest. I started writing when they were infants. My first critique group, I think one was six months and one was 20 months, and I would sneak away at nap times to write, and I did that until they were both in kindergarten, first grade, and that's when I sold the first book. So I've been working to the school bus and the daily school schedule, it seems like ever since.
Speaker 2:And then time goes by so fast, right, like doesn't that just mean, like it was not that long ago.
Speaker 3:It wasn't. My dog's got used to the school bus schedule so I still have one dog laughed and she's still on that. It's three o'clock, we gotta stop.
Speaker 2:So I've read a handful of your books and since then I have put gosh. You have like 40 books, Is that true? I?
Speaker 3:think between the two it's closer like 55.
Speaker 2:Oh my gosh, it's a lot. You've written a lot in your life and I think that that's admirable to come up with so much content. But what I love about your stories is there is a suspense part, like a mystery, trying to figure out what's going on part, and a love story part. So I feel like you almost get multiple stories in one book and you do such a good job of kind of like intertwining all of that.
Speaker 3:And that's the trick when you're writing romantic suspense is to thread or braid the stories together, because it can't just be romance and it just can't be suspense. They each have to constantly be complicating the other and it just makes it just. It's one more reason to turn the page. It's one more reason to add tension to the, to the story. So I'm always looking, I'll take tension from romance or suspense or police procedure or ticking clocks or it's whatever keeps those pages turning for the reader.
Speaker 2:So I mostly read, listen to my books on Audible, and the way that I initially discovered you is Brittany Presley is one of my favorite narrators, and so I just kind of searched, like all the books that she's narrated, and that's how I kind of stumbled upon you. Do you have any say in who narrates your books? For like Audible situations Every so?
Speaker 3:often they'll give me a list of three narrators to listen to their voices. But I've gotten to the point where I just trust their choices because I don't think I have ever had a bad one. I great narrators and they people who cast narrators, they know their business so I usually trust them. But yeah, occasionally I will listen or I'll say, hey, this person narrated the last book in the series. Maybe we could keep her to keep it consistent. But generally they'll, they'll choose for me.
Speaker 2:There's just so much like you don't really think about all of that that goes into things, and sometimes your mind starts to just think about it.
Speaker 3:Oh, I know they'll ask me for a questionnaire on each book and when I'm talking to the audio narrators they're looking for accent, age, tone of voice and I'm trying to remember what did this person sound like? Because they they're in hearing and sound is their venue and for me it's kind of like well, use it, make the lead person in my head. So I have to really drill into what did this person sound like? And if they have questions, they can always email me and say, hey, what do you mean? And I will go into as much detail as they need.
Speaker 2:You, so I feel like you write a lot of crime fiction, detective police procedurals. Did you ever want to work in law enforcement or forensics?
Speaker 3:No, I have an English degree but I've always loved mysteries and my first I started off writing historical romance. I wrote about eight of those, but I always wanted to write mysteries. So I did some, did four short romantic suspense. I was starting to dip my toe into police procedure and the one thing I learned was know your jurisdiction, know where you are. And then I was trying to write a longer suspense novel and I joined the citizens police academy in Henrico County, virginia, and it was a 12 week course and every Wednesday we'd go in and we'd hear a lecture about something in the law enforcement offices. And that gave me my first taste.
Speaker 3:For this is how police department works. This is what you have to work with when you're, when you're writing a story. And then I took the writers police academy. I think I've been to 10 of them and that's when this former police officer created this writers retreat for writers who really want to get into the native grade of police procedure. And those have been amazing, because when I listen to the lectures I always walk away from that conference with a couple of story ideas. Or if I'm stuck, I can walk up to an expert and say, hey, I have a body, this is the temperature. This is where it's right next to water. Can you tell me what I'm looking at and then they can give me exact details and those little details can make a story kind of pop. I think you don't want to, you don't want to do a dissertation on police procedure, but you want to have those key details that make it just believable.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that is so neat and that's cool that they offer stuff like that for you or for people in general. I didn't even know that was a thing, yeah.
Speaker 3:They'll be doing another one. I haven't been for a couple of years because little far out of banks is not close to much anymore. But I've also. I've read tons of books on police procedure, shallow graves. I mean, when I show up at the library they would just look at me like why are you checking all this stuff out? What are you planning?
Speaker 3:to do here Exactly. Excuse me, but and I would say, I'm a writer, would you like to see my bookmark? And but yeah, I've read a lot, because, again, those little details can make a book and I could spend a day reading a book and it gets spoiled down into five lines in a novel, but if it makes the story sharper it's always worth it.
Speaker 2:And I feel like forensics, it changes a lot. I mean, that's really especially in your career of writing. Think about what law enforcement, what tools they had at that point compared to now.
Speaker 3:I like the DNA matching now wasn't around 15 years ago when I started writing 15, 20 years ago when I started writing this, and now they catch people through DNA and ancestry and all that good stuff, or you know, the GED match. I think that's fascinating. Yeah, I mean it has changed. The forensics is also dependent on a jurisdiction. So if I'm in a little town in the middle of nowhere, I'm not going to have all the bells and whistles. I'm going to have a maybe a fingerprint kit and luminol in the trunk of my car. How can I solve a case with just those two? Or if I'm in a big jurisdiction and I have the opportunity to have a forensic anthropologist artist, you know, then I can go that way. And how do you rebuild a face from just a skull? I find all that fascinating and sometimes I probably spend more time researching than I should. But I find it all fascinating how they pull these pieces together.
Speaker 2:And I think that's good. If you keep learning about new things, that's going to keep your brain churning right with new ideas.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I always say the book is in the research, that if you are stuck in some way about, start reading some research and it'll pop out the real details can just really fuel your characters, your stories, because they're all you know, that's the foundation that they're standing on, that the research. And so I'm always trying to read something new just to keep it fresh, Because you know, when you've done 25 or 30 of them, it's, you know, trying to keep it fresh.
Speaker 2:And suspense does change Something different yeah, something different.
Speaker 3:How can I make this story interesting to readers in a way I've never done it before? That's the tricky part.
Speaker 2:That is tricky. That's why I think it's so amazing that you do it Now. You said that you have a English major Right, Correct.
Speaker 3:Did you always want? No, go ahead go ahead, go ahead, go ahead.
Speaker 2:I was just going to say. Was your intent to be a writer someday with that, or what was your kind of plan with getting your degrees?
Speaker 3:I don't think I had much of a plan then. I just knew I enjoyed it and I met. When I got out of college I went into sales because that's how I could earn a living, and so I was doing sales for probably seven or eight years in different venues. And then, but the stories I kept having stories that were churning in my head. So I joined the Virginia Romance Writers which writers group in Central Virginia Because I thought, well, let me just see what other writers talk about. How do they do this? How do we actually write a book?
Speaker 3:And then I started to meet other writers who were kind of on the same path as me and several of us joined up and created a critique group and we met every Friday and we would exchange chapters and we would talk about each other's work and they learned a lot about the craft of writing. It is something anybody can learn. And then I started finding books about the craft of writing, like techniques of a selling writer by Dwight Swain very technical, but it teaches you a lot about story and how you construct a story. And I still have several dozen books on writing that I'll go back and read every so often Because I think again. It's like the forensic research you go back to the basics and just kind of refresh yourself and you might come back with something different. It'll teach you how to tell a story just a little bit differently than you did last time.
Speaker 2:For your character development. What's your inspiration to create new characters?
Speaker 3:That's always, I find it's. I'm finishing up the current manuscript Because we can get into this later, but I usually do about 10 or 11 drafts of a book and by the time I'm really smoothing it out and convinced I will have no more story ideas. The new characters start to appear and it's usually a little something that I call like the jumping off point. It's a little something about them. Was it, were they the victim of a crime? Was it an unsolved case? What is the thing that they're chasing? What do they need to? What do they think they want and what do they really need to have? They're usually two different things, but there's a moment or jumping off point where the character just I don't get the whole story, but this is the nugget of who they are. Now how do I build a plot around that? Because I think if I start with that character and their wants and their needs, then I can keep that in mind as I'm building the story, because the story and the character are two sides of the same coin. They're interwoven, they're inseparable.
Speaker 3:No good If you have a character that needs validation but all they're getting is validation. They're not being challenged. But if you have a character that needs validation and is getting everything. But they're going to start and they need to chase it. You want to give something, the character, whatever they want. You can't give it to them till toward the end of the book. They have to go through a character arc and learn to be. The person they were at the beginning of the book has to change. They need to change and learn to figure out something so that they can get what they secretly don't need Maybe not even realize what they need. Anyway, that's my theory.
Speaker 2:I like that. I like that you start with, kind of, like you said, that jump off point and that kind of helps you because your mind's kind of in that super creative zone when you're getting to the end of the story, then, yeah, sometimes that kind of is, it's just really fresh in your mind and then you're ready to, like you said, jump off and create that next person. I do.
Speaker 3:I keep a pad and every time these little nuggets come to me. I don't use them all, but I'm always. I have lists everywhere.
Speaker 2:I was wondering that, like, do you just randomly jot stuff down as it like comes into your mind?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I've got receipts in my purse from the grocery store and a lot of there's notes all over them. It's like I'll be in the grocery store and I'll jot, and I never have paper, so I'm always jotting on a random receipt or something.
Speaker 2:I love that. I was going to say you travel a lot and do a lot of like research on location and, like you said, jurisdiction. I think that is so cool because, personally, when I read a book, that's from where I live. I think that's so fascinating because you can picture it more clearly where, as when you're reading a book. One of the things I love about reading is you kind of, in your imagination, get to develop what everything is looking like and you kind of get to paint your own picture. And a lot of times I say, like when they make movies out of books, like sometimes it's frustrating because it's not what you envisioned at all. So it kind of like it's like that's not what I would have done, that's not what I envisioned.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and I would say a reader is a character in a book. They were one of the invisible characters in my book because they're bringing their own sense of life and what they want, wants and needs and into the story. So if I say a barn, five people might hear barn and see something completely different in their minds. So I mean that's so. I'm always aware that a reader is going to bring their own vision of the world when they're, when they're reading the book, which is good. That means I get questions all the time Like well, did you mean this, this? And it's like, yeah, sure, I did, yeah.
Speaker 3:I'm glad you saw it that way.
Speaker 2:Do you ever use a personal life events in your work?
Speaker 3:Not really, because my life, you know it's, it's not, it's. I write, I work out, I have a dog, husband, we're not that exciting. We always joke. If we were a reality show we'd be canceled because we're just, we're pretty dull, you know, just study as you go. So no, not a lot from life. But I do pay attention to people and people often comment I can be quiet and I'm just pay attentioning to people and what they're talking about, their life experiences, what's happening with them. And again, sometimes you hear those oh, there's a jumping off point for that, maybe another novel, not their life story, but a moment or a comment that gets you thinking, oh, that could be, I could, oh, I could work around that. So yeah, I'm always paying attention. I'm sitting in a coffee shop, don't talk around me.
Speaker 3:It might be the next book, idea that's right, it might be the next book idea exactly.
Speaker 2:You write under a pseudonym, as we talked about earlier. Why? Why would a writer or author do that?
Speaker 3:Well, when I was writing Suspense and really enjoying it. But this other book kind of kept coming up in my head and I knew it did fit the suspense world. And I also know that your name as a writer is a brand. So when you pick up a Mary Burton book it's going to be a scary suspense. You know that or you're going to expect it. But if I all suddenly give you a women's fiction book about families and sisters and history, you might be disappointed.
Speaker 3:So I created Mary Ellen Taylor just to create a different brand, so that she has a different she does. It's a different vibe, it's a different type of story. And they're both great because they both allow me to kind of flex different muscles and I've discovered that I can put a little suspense in Mary Ellen Taylor books and they can put a little bit more personal interaction in the Mary Burton books. So it's been. I mean, I just enjoy telling different stories. So that's how Mary Ellen was and I had been up in Alexandria, virginia, at a mystery writers conference and I'd left early and I knew the kids didn't get off the bus till three.
Speaker 3:So I swung through Alexandria and went to the history center there on the river and they had this big display on the Jameson Bakery and driving home this character that kept bugging me. It made sense, now that she might work in this bakery, that this there would be an old story and a current story and it just kind of went from there. But yeah, I, like I said, I enjoy history, enjoy English, enjoy the puzzle of a mystery.
Speaker 2:When you start a book, do you know how it ends, or are you kind of surprised what direction it goes in as you continue to write?
Speaker 3:It's kind of like when you're driving somewhere you know you're going to end up in Kansas City somewhere, but how you get there it's going to change along the way depending on the weather, the roads. You're going to see a lot of surprises in one way and when you get there you may realize where you thought you were going to be in town is the wrong place. It's going to be a little different and I've written especially the suspense novels. If I'm on like the second or third draft and the resolution feels too obvious to me, then I'll go back to the beginning. It's like how can I adjust these clues and what I tell the reader to make it not so obvious or make it make it even somebody else Like I didn't even see it coming. So if I surprise myself, I'll definitely surprise a reader.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I read, I see you recently. I finished that last weekend in two days and the twists, the twists in that book. I didn't see any of it coming. And sometimes you know, you feel like when you read a lot, like you can kind of start to see stuff like unraveling a little bit, or or you've read so many books you kind of know like how plot twists work and you can kind of guess it. But that one got me from multiple directions. So anyway, I highly recommend reading that book if you haven't, and you're listening to this.
Speaker 3:But I love that I didn't see it coming either. That's that was like one of those second or third drafts where it's like, hey, wait a minute, maybe I could make it more by doing this. That happens a lot.
Speaker 2:And I like to how it's not necessarily like that book is in a part of a series, but it's like a book to have cases that tie into each other from like previous books. So when I read that one I didn't even realize that there was a book that could have been before that. But I like that you don't necessarily have to read them in order.
Speaker 3:They're all standalone. I think these were all set in old to Alexandria, virginia, because I'd been up there researching for the Mary Ellen Taylor novel and I thought, ah, this is a great location for suspense novels. I've got DC, I've got I 95. There's a lot of suspense elements I can use from this city and so, yeah, you might see sometimes when I use the same setting, but just one becomes a suspense and then one becomes a women's fiction. It's just the pressure points you put in the story.
Speaker 3:The house beyond the dunes. I had just written the Brighter the Light, which was set down here on the Outer Banks, so I'd gotten to know the area really well. And then my husband and I drove up on to. It's called the four by four, it's the most northern beach and it's only accessible by four-wheel drive. And we're driving up there and looking at the wild horses. It's gorgeous, the dogs are running around and I thought, oh, in January and a storm, this could be a great suspense location. So, yeah, yeah, so yeah. You'll see I'll get lots of inspiration from different locations, or the same location can spur several novels.
Speaker 2:How do you know when or if a book is gonna become a series?
Speaker 3:Sometime. When I wrote the Brighter the Light, mary Ellen Taylor, there was a character in there named Danny and she had a huge unresolved issue by the end of the book. It's not fixable. How do you move on with life? And I'm not giving anything away, well, no, I'm not gonna tell you I'll let if you haven't read it. But I kept thinking, you know, or exactly I thought you know, she probably could have another novel. And I haven't done that.
Speaker 3:Very often I've done it with a couple of books. Or if it's suspense, I'll create a department of investigators and each has their own story. But I think it's important that every book stand alone. I wanna read it or pick it up and feel like they haven't missed anything. So if it is a second book, I spend very little time on the book before. As far as I'm concerned, it's over and done with and there might be bits of it to come through the second book. But again, I think it's important to be stand alone. Do you like to read? I do like to read. I just finished Rebecca Yaros, the fourth wing, which I thought was great.
Speaker 2:Oh, people are really reading that right now. I've seen a lot of that. They are my coworkers, desks.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I do tend to like that, and I'm also reading Frankenstein by Mary Shelley because I'm on this kit to go back and look at some of the classics and just see what was it about them that were still reading it 200 years later. I mean, what is it about the way she put this story together? So I'll let you know. I'm just getting started. It's a different reading experience because words have changed a lot in a couple. The way we tell story is always evolving and it's changed a lot since her days.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm sure that's super fascinating Cause there's so many new books being written all the time, right? So I feel like, as a reader, I'm trying to keep up with what's current.
Speaker 3:But, yeah, sometimes like just going back to like how things started and seeing, like you said, the evolution is, you know and I'm always looking at the once you're a writer I don't think you always read for super pleasure anymore You're always thinking in terms of, oh, what a great technique, this was nicely done, a great character development. So you're always thinking as a writer. So when I go back and look at the classics, it's like, okay, the writing styles have changed, but what was it about the characters that has lived? So it's something in that book that readers still you know, they're still making revisions of it or versions of it in TV and film. And what is it about the some of these classic books that still stand the test of time? So that's my latest kick. I'm trying to come up with an answer to that.
Speaker 2:You'll let us know right when you figure it out.
Speaker 3:Exactly, I figured it out. Probably show up in a book.
Speaker 2:When I was doing a little bit of research on you, I saw that you, like you, said you're down to one, but you had two Doxies and I am a really big Doxy fan. You had three.
Speaker 3:Three. We lost one last year, one a couple of months ago and the last man standing is sleeping right behind me. Aw, he has a little doxing couch right behind me Cute.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:Have you always. We didn't get dogs until the kids were in high school and we even had a friend joke like why are you getting puppies now? You know, you were almost free. You're almost empty nesters and we laugh about that a lot, but no, they're a great source of joy. We had the first, buddy and Bella, when they were seven weeks old and they made it to 15 and 16. So amazing, amazing little creatures.
Speaker 2:And I always tell my husband that when I'm like old and retired, I'm just gonna get a little long-haired Doxy and he or she is just gonna sit on my lap all day while I read or go for a little jaunt or whatever. Just a little partner in crime.
Speaker 3:That's exactly what I have. Her name is Tiki and, yeah, she is never more than about two feet from me.
Speaker 2:Oh, I love that. Let's see here. I think this I was kind of winding down, but I just wanted to also put out there for anybody who hasn't read your books or wants to know more about you. I follow you on Instagram. I love how much you post about advice and information that you give about being a writer to be helpful. I feel like a lot of writers aren't willing to do that and I think that's just really lovely that you do that. You share brainstorming, you tips, inspiration, writing hacks Like if people get stuck secrets and you know so make sure that you do follow Mary and she's at Mary Burton Books on Instagram.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, it's hard to figure out how to be a writer and if I can just offer a little bit of wisdom very quickly, I don't, there are 30 seconds or less. But yeah, I'm happy to do that. I've always enjoyed because you know the conferences. You don't get out to be able to speak at them as much as we used to because of COVID and travel, and I thought, well, I'll just do it on Instagram and I think that being a short clip is helpful because you don't lose anyone's attention Like it's quick, it's to the point and it's like, oh, that is a good idea.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's important to keep it quick and I'm gonna reach out to people on Instagram more to say what do you want to know about writing? What do you what inside? I mean, what do you wanna know? You tell me and I'll figure out how to answer it. But, yeah, I'll be doing that in January, kind of reaching out to readers more, because I do like to get their input. Like, you know, what's your favorite name of a character? What's your favorite location? I like hearing that. It's great energy.
Speaker 2:What's next for you, Mary? Well, I'm just Working on anything.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I just turned in a Spence novel. I just turned it in and finished story edits like two weeks ago. So that one's done and I am applauding. I applauded the next, mary Ellen Taylor. I'm writing with synopsis, so I usually, when I think I'm done, I let it sit for a day and I but there's Because there's always like one more. So I try to figure out as much as I can about the book before I write it. But there's always something I'm going to have to figure out. But so I'm at that point now where it's done and I'm starting to take notes for the next Mary Burton suspense Again, like how do you make it different? I mean, how do you keep readers turning those pages? So they're both. Both the Mary's keep me busy.
Speaker 2:And then anything you're looking forward to any new goals?
Speaker 3:Goals. That's a good one. I've got this other novel that is always just back there, it doesn't fit anywhere. So I may work on that a little bit more this year in some spare time, because that's fun for me, because anytime I try something new, even if I never send it out, it teaches me something. There's always a different way to tell a story. Often helps the other genres that I work in or have deadlines. So, yeah, there's always something out there I'm thinking about. I think you always have to be reaching for something. My philosophy is either going forward or you're falling back. So I'm always trying to think forward in terms of what could be next, what could I tackle. So that's where I am with that right now.
Speaker 2:One of the things I like is when you say set a time 30 minutes an hour and just keep typing, because you never know what could just start to come out. And it doesn't have to be anything that's concrete, you don't have to keep it, but just type away and see where your brain goes and what comes out.
Speaker 3:Exactly. That's why I set daily page goals. So when I'm writing rough draft I make myself like 15 pages and they don't have to be good pages, but I make myself Because I'd been out in New Mexico gosh 20 years ago and I heard Tony Hillerman speak in Mystery Writer and he talked about his daily pages. He was trying to get it done. He didn't feel like it. He'd been working all day and his character looks up in the rear view mirror and he sees the dog in the back seat. Because I didn't plot that dog, I didn't know where that dog came from. I didn't care because I got my pages for the day done. But he said that dog became integral in the rest of the story. So your subconscious has got a lot of the ideas. So if you're making yourself tight, they will come out. Maybe you're going to have to go back and do a lot of editing, but they will come out if you just keep typing. That's another philosophy. I have Just keep typing.
Speaker 2:Mary, thank you so much for coming on the podcast and chatting with us. It was such a joy to have you and meet you and I plan to keep on reading your novels and even I'm going to dabble in Mary Ellen Taylor. I kind of am interested now. That's usually not a genre I read, but I'm intrigued.
Speaker 3:She's always got a little mystery going on too. Good, good, good. But thank you so much for having me. This was great.
Speaker 2:Absolutely Well. I hope you have a great rest of your day and maybe we'll talk to you soon.
Speaker 3:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:All right, Mackie, I'm really excited that you might have a really hard to decide. Would you rather for me this week?
Speaker 1:All right, you ready for it? My would you rather is would you rather get away with lying all the time or knowing someone's lying every time?
Speaker 2:I would always rather know when people are lying. I, it was. One of my biggest pet peeves is lying. I think that you shouldn't make decisions that are going to make you have to lie about it or that you're going to have to regret so, and people also tell a lot of unnecessary white lies and I that also drives me crazy, like why do you have to lie about that? So that's my choice. What?
Speaker 1:about you. So I have to think I also want to know when people are lying. But then I feel like I feel like some things that people lie about are like good, because, like you know, they would know you wouldn't like it. But I feel like if I were to know when someone's lying, I feel like that'd be good for like certain jobs, like like being a detective or something, or like an investigator, and like there was like witnesses, I feel like that'd be really good. But I'm not going to go with knowing someone lies every time.
Speaker 2:So you're trying to spin it where you would want to be a good liar for a good reason. But I know it's because you tell me a lot of lies and you wish I wouldn't know when you were doing it.
Speaker 1:No, I would want to know when everyone lies. If anyone lies, not to get away with lying. So yeah, I'm going to pick with knowing when everyone lies, because I feel like it's just better.
Speaker 2:All right, I have a super funny joke for you. Are you ready for this one?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I am.
Speaker 2:All right, if slow old men use walking sticks, what do fast old men use?
Speaker 1:I don't know what Hurricanes. I don't understand it, I don't get it.
Speaker 2:A hurricane is like a fast storm and a walking stick is for being slow and a hurricane is for walking fast.
Speaker 1:Oh, okay, I get it Okay.
Speaker 2:Ha, ha, ha ha, that's funny.
Speaker 1:You're so funny.
Speaker 2:Hey, you said that's one of the things that you like the most about me is that I'm funny.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I know, I know.
Speaker 2:All right, that's all we have for you this week, but stay tuned, because we have a lot of great things coming for you. We'll see you next week. Bye, spider bed.